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I could be wrong but the thought that comes to mind in my head is blame goes to United for flying a potentially non-flightworthy plane. My first thought goes to the airline.
I saw this on the news the other day. I didn't know it flew from San Francisco. I actually flew United from San Francisco to DC on Saturday.
There’s damage to the wing below/behind where the slat sits on the wing in the retracted position (see indentations in wing). That could imply that the slat “snagged” on the wing when it began to move to the extended position and thereby tore itself apart.
The question is, was this a maintenance problem or a defect in design. Still isn’t a great look either way
Looking at the slat…it’s “torn” from the bottom-side where it rubs against the wing surface. It snagged on fasteners during deployment. The damaged/snagged fasteners on the wing are apparent.
Boeing doesn’t maintain that aircraft. Untied does.
I’m jus’ knowin’…
The Shop
It really doesn't matter who maintained the aircraft. The vast amount of people that fly have no mechanical knowledge and cannot reason it out that way. They see a damaged wing on a Boeing aircraft right after a door made an unplanned disassembly inflight on a Boeing aircraft. How long do you think before people start to plan their trips based on flying on a Boeing vs Airbus aircraft? It's the optics that will kill them.
TM
So in the last week, we've had 3 Boeing jet incidents. All different planes mind you. And yes I'm aware that the jet itself is not the issue for all these things going on but the fact that they are all Boeing is really bad for the company
in the last 7 days, an engine fire, a jet having an off runway excursion, and most recently a wheel just falling off moments after takeoff. (Where's Peely? tighten the fucking bolts LOL) But seriously, this is not a laughing matter. Why are our maintenance crews doing such a poor job? Or, are they doing their job and there are design/manufacturing flaws? Surely the wheel incident is a maintenance bungle.
TM
My guess would be the D.E.I new hires that I would imagine the DOT is probably pressuring upon them.
I’m curious if the incident rate is increasing, or if they are simply being reported, when in the past those same incidents were not considered news-worthy. Once a subject (Boeing) hits the radar, the cameras follow.
I can't imagine any of these incidents ever not being news worthy.
We definitely have lowered the bar of excellence to be more inclusive of a diverse group of employees. How exactly is diverse employees better than "the best" employees? I don't know, but even if you look at how they changed the rules to become air traffic controllers, do you want better qualified or more skin colors in the tower. I'm all about hiring the best possible regardless of skin color. And for the idiots that won't hire because of skin color, you guys are despicable.
TM
Answer: Job Qualifications, Training & Certification Standards…across the board.
Most people have no idea how much maintenance the airlines are responsible and “how soon” in an ac’s service life that the ac’s reliability is affected by that. As some in here know, the “real” old school “A&P” types are mostly gone…retired…expired…etc.
Automation has been at the core of this, too…or…should I say…
MANAGEMENTS MISREPRESENTATION & FALSE RELIANCE ON AUTOMATION. This is also true of the MCAS crashes and loss of life that caused the “Max grounding of 2020”…if you recall? The aircraft was “self-correcting” itself…RIGHT INTO THE GROUND. Why? Automation was “supposed to” fly the plane and make it so simple that any poorly trained 3rd world airline pilot could just get in it and go…never mind that system and data input redundancy has been FORGOTTEN…LIKELY INTENTIONALLY…as testified to…during design and test. Data Redundancy Adherence would have saved those ac if they were so equipped.
To be clear, EVERYONE WAS IN ON IT…
The Airlines
Boeing…who threw their classic “test until it fails” out the door in the name of profits.
The Fucking Pilots Union!
THE FAA…!
Everyone WAS IN ON IT.
So, THAT…right there…INTENTIONAL MISMANAGEMENT…is HOW WE GOT HERE. Well, that…and they’re all hiring complete F’ING idiots to work the aircraft…and I’m talking from the cockpit to the refueling trucks to stocking the food carts.
Sad; but, true.
We need better people. We need to get back to lots and lots of training & flt hours…military hires…etc., etc., etc. Even letting some current FORCED OUT DUE TO AGE pilots STAY ON THE JOB.
But, what do I know?
To be fair on that point, those pilots probably could have flown the AC not into the ground but did not know how to override the "autocorrection". I don't blame the pilots on that one. Everyone thought that the computer was better than the pilot.
Makes you go Hmmm.
Mentour Pilot has a few videos on Boeing. Here is one of the recent videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNzVufBJR64
If you are interested in aviation you will probably enjoy his channels.
General Topics:
https://www.youtube.com/@MentourNow
Incident/Accident breakdowns mostly:
https://www.youtube.com/@MentourPilot
Correct me if I'm wrong but it appears in reading your post that D.E.I. only has to do with skin color?
People have been booking flights based on Airbus vs Boeing for years now... The stock price reflects it too.
I writing comments here not novels
FYI, 20 years ago when my wife and I started the company that made architectural detail products, our first employee happened to be a lesbian. We didn't hire her because of that, we hired her because we believed she was the best person to do the required work. Not that that's something to be proud about, it's just the way things should be. It's when you lower your standards so you can hire someone to claim to be diverse that's the problem. When I went through the fire academy (40 years ago), there was a pull up standard. There were a couple of girls that couldn't do the 3 pull ups, they lowered the standard to pass the girls.
TM
Pit Row
John Oliver on Boeing
https://youtu.be/Q8oCilY4szc?si=SWeUhvx_TTLO4Z1P
Went to Costco earlier today wearing this shirt thought I was gonna get mugged!
Couple people mentioned Boeing, one had a son that worked in Seattle and one was a former employee.
We agreed we can't believe how far the company has gone downhill.
There have been real struggles ever since I retired from there 8 months ago.😂😃🤣
Maybe we need to be weary of United, all 3 events were United flights.
Most of us (at least where I use to work) old school A&Ps are leaving the job because of the new generation of mechanics and the state of aviation overall. It scares the hell out of me, the new attitude is IT'S GOOD ENOUGH!! Man, that kind of thinking use to keep me up at night. I was the head maintenance guy and helped with hiring, we would interview at least 10 guys (if they even show up) to hire one guy and most of the time I was not really happy with them, but the DOM would say we need to fill the spot!! WTF. I worked on Boeing only aircraft for over 40yrs and next gen aircraft for the last 20 plus years.
Don't get me started on the spare parts that we would receive from overhaul again WTF. At one point we were near 50% rejection on replacement parts, we were changing venders all the time trying to lower the rejection rate. Try being a mechanic that spends up to 4hrs to replace and test a component to find out that it is bad from stock, nothing ruins a mechanic confidence faster than installing a part that is bad and you (the mech) is not sure if you are wrong or the new part is FUCKED UP!!!
Man, I could go on forever I am glad I am retired!!!!!! OHHH stay off the MAX, at least until they get that piece of shit figured out.
That's very enlightening. Now we're back to square 1. We have no idea if it's the maintenance team, the design, or the actual parts being bad. I sure hope this is not a sign of the times. Air travel used to be the safest place on earth so to speak, statistically speaking anyway.
And of that, weren't 2 of them flying out of San Francisco? Were all 3 out of California?
I don't know but it would not surprise me. I'm sure that maintenance is done per a schedule and they organize the planes being at the airport when that schedule requires it. I think there are a select few airports that do scheduled maintenance vs, something is wrong and needs fixing right there. So if it's a bad part installed or incorrectly installed, we'd see things like this leaving those centers.
Did you see the wheel come off the 777 at SFO? I fly thru SFO on United almost weekly. Often taking trans-Pac flts on SFO serviced equipment.
I canceled this weeks/todays flt.
I’m in a holding pattern for the near future. Even told United as much in an email.
Buy buy buy, it'll go up.. good price at the moment!!!
I saw that, that's what inspired revival of the thread. But did you also see malfunctioning landing gear. That's worse in my opinion. You can land safely with missing wheels, yes several, there's that much safety factor on blowouts. But a whole landing gear? You only have 3. This shit is happening way to often recently.
There isn't "one" single factor causing these problems for Boeing. But when SCHEDULE becomes the over riding goal...this is the result. I have seen it and experienced it many times.
The FAA holds some fault in this as well. They delegated most of the inspection responsibility to the manufacturers. If the company inspectors are pressured to not interfere with "schedule"...that puts them in a bad spot. They are officially FAA delegates but work for the company. That's one of those jobs where you keep your resume updated.
Boeing engineering has gone to shit also. Last experience with the repair engineering department was a real shit show, seems like the new engineers don't even know what an aircraft is. It took the two weeks to figure out a little repair that should have taken no more than a day. My company (I have retired) is a really good Boeing customer and we were always pushed to the front of the line for engineering when we asked for a quick solution which was not very often.
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