Is the CR500 the only bike that could be competitive 20 years later?

MyBobbym
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MyBobbym 12/12/2020 2:18pm
12/12/2020 2:18pm
89 Kx500 could still do it. It's the rider and his skillz that trump any new tech shit.
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CPR
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CPR 12/12/2020 2:38pm
12/12/2020 2:38pm
Dropbear wrote:
One of my favourite memories was the Australian 2000 500 MXGP led by Michael Byrne on a near stock CR500 and Andrew McFarlane on a KX500...
One of my favourite memories was the Australian 2000 500 MXGP led by Michael Byrne on a near stock CR500 and Andrew McFarlane on a KX500 hybrid. One of the last hurrahs for the big 2 strokea.
Never made it to the GP but I did see Byrner and McFarlane have an epic battle on those bikes in a lead up race at Echo Valley.
The big hills and good traction at Echo Valley made it a place where 500s still ruled over 250s and the 4t’s of that era.
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Carl 44
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Carl 44 12/16/2020 6:55am
12/16/2020 6:55am
I give Neville Bradshaw a lot of credit for slicing and dicing on the steel CR500R. They actually handle very good and do very well in sweeping turns but not when it’s extremely tight. If the ergonomics were better and you could get further forward it would help.
I think Neville has done an unbelievable job but I wish he had a CR500AF and we could see how much better he could do on one.
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queen of spodes 12/16/2020 1:50pm
12/16/2020 1:50pm
Dropbear wrote:
One of my favourite memories was the Australian 2000 500 MXGP led by Michael Byrne on a near stock CR500 and Andrew McFarlane on a KX500...
One of my favourite memories was the Australian 2000 500 MXGP led by Michael Byrne on a near stock CR500 and Andrew McFarlane on a KX500 hybrid. One of the last hurrahs for the big 2 strokea.
got a vid link for that?

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Analogue* 12/16/2020 11:49pm
12/16/2020 11:49pm
Interesting thread. Don't know much about the CR500R but I bought a new one back in '01, last one in the shop. Still sitting in my shed, never clicked into gear. Spent some time on the KX500 though, must be close to 250 hours in the saddle now. Still got my '04. They get along ok, short shifting the KX5 is a must in the first three gears and the wheel would always lift up in top gear, traction permitting. The Brakes were never as good a CR500 but the power was always nice, Good memories
Analogue* 12/16/2020 11:56pm
12/16/2020 11:56pm
When I said I bought a new CR500 back in '01. Have to add that I went to the bank and borrowed every penny to buy that bike. I'm not a rich man, now and then. No regrets though. I just had to have it.
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backinthesaddleagain 12/17/2020 9:38am
12/17/2020 9:38am
Chance1216 wrote:
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had...
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had a lot of issues with jetting and ultimately had to get the head cut a little to get rid of the detonation. Nothing like a scary, lock to lock bar swap. I got rid of it like the dummy I was and, got an 88 CR 250. I wish I could’ve kept a lot of bikes I’ve had over the years. Ill mannered or not, old 500s are still the crown jewel of two strokes to me.
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and try to race with the same aggressiveness. Thing was a hoot, tiring and hard to start hoot!
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LKHill
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LKHill 12/17/2020 2:50pm
12/17/2020 2:50pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and...
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and try to race with the same aggressiveness. Thing was a hoot, tiring and hard to start hoot!
That had the worst kind of light switch powerband. Absolute violence and it caught a lot of folks off guard with how smooth the '83 480 was.
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Chance1216
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Chance1216 12/17/2020 4:53pm
12/17/2020 4:53pm
Chance1216 wrote:
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had...
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had a lot of issues with jetting and ultimately had to get the head cut a little to get rid of the detonation. Nothing like a scary, lock to lock bar swap. I got rid of it like the dummy I was and, got an 88 CR 250. I wish I could’ve kept a lot of bikes I’ve had over the years. Ill mannered or not, old 500s are still the crown jewel of two strokes to me.
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and...
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and try to race with the same aggressiveness. Thing was a hoot, tiring and hard to start hoot!
Ever try starting it on a muddy hill in the rain? Frustration reaches a whole new level.
Ted722
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Ted722 12/17/2020 5:58pm
12/17/2020 5:58pm
Analogue* wrote:
When I said I bought a new CR500 back in '01. Have to add that I went to the bank and borrowed every penny to buy...
When I said I bought a new CR500 back in '01. Have to add that I went to the bank and borrowed every penny to buy that bike. I'm not a rich man, now and then. No regrets though. I just had to have it.
I love my ‘01. Fun on the moto track and surprisingly capable off-road. I’ve done some hare scrambles over the years on it and it’s been a grin fest for 2 plus hours including the “anonymous fan zone cheering” as I went by timing and scoring.

They knew I was on a 500 and for those whose didn’t, I gave them a couple 500cc braaps as a reminder! Good times.
1
backinthesaddleagain 12/17/2020 8:05pm
12/17/2020 8:05pm
Chance1216 wrote:
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had...
I did have an air cooled 84 that was like a light switch for lack of better words. I was only 19 at the time. Had a lot of issues with jetting and ultimately had to get the head cut a little to get rid of the detonation. Nothing like a scary, lock to lock bar swap. I got rid of it like the dummy I was and, got an 88 CR 250. I wish I could’ve kept a lot of bikes I’ve had over the years. Ill mannered or not, old 500s are still the crown jewel of two strokes to me.
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and...
I raced an 84 CR500 and 85 CR125 in 1985. What a blast. Especially if the 125 class ran first. I'd hop on the 500 and try to race with the same aggressiveness. Thing was a hoot, tiring and hard to start hoot!
Chance1216 wrote:
Ever try starting it on a muddy hill in the rain? Frustration reaches a whole new level.
No, luckily not. and who’d have thought back then about an electric start.
1
CPR
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CPR 12/19/2020 4:47am
12/19/2020 4:47am
queen of spodes wrote:
got a vid link for that?
Dropbear wrote:
Not a vid, but I found this.

https://transmoto.com.au/andrew-mcfarlanes-proudest-moto-moment/
There used to be a video of the race on YouTube but it appears the copyright police got it.

If I remember rightly Sharky’s bike was a 500 motor in a current KX250 frame, built with parts from local dealership Whale Kawasak and his dad was his mechanic. Certainly nothing exotic, but he holeshot all the unobtainium factory bikes, with fellow Aussie Byrner in tow on a stock CR500 with bolt-ons.

Side note- Max Whale, son of Whale Kawasaki owner Brett Whale is now racing pro dirt track in the USA.


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mofomotojoe
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mofomotojoe 12/21/2020 11:48pm
12/21/2020 11:48pm
I grew up indoctrinated with the myth of the mighty CR500.
The God machine of our sport. I would gaze at giant posters of Thorpe, Malherbe, Bailey, RJ, JMB...
The symbol of Honda's domination, the red ultimate machine...
Decades go by with multiples CR250s.. I finally grab myself a clean 1997 CR500 and pour tons of money on it.

Tried to fall in love with the thing. Then I swapped bikes with a guy who had a beat up CR500.
Man, all the money poured on it did not enhance it into the ultimate dirt bike. The beat up one is just as good. The clean one is just as dated.

Then I swapped bikes with a modern KTM250. Should have never done that. Sorry Honda, after decades on CRs I sold my soul to the Austrian chassis.
Not everything is perfect on Austrian bikes, but the handling/stability compromise, me being older...
It felt like a second youth.
Got a 300. Sold the CR500. Never, ever, been more happy than on the mid-size bore and the KTM chassis.
And yet just a few years ago I would mock them. Went to a Jarvis school. Having fun on a bike that is way more versatile and better all around, learning new things and having loads of FUN.

Podcasts of Ricky Johnson, he says he didn't like the 500 as much as we thought. Wow. Bailey also talks about how his production based 500 was a pig compared to the ultra trick works bikes.
Kiedrowski and Bayle are the two who liked the 500 better.

Anyway. For me it was a big big myth and an utter disappointment once I had one.
I recall late 90s racing in B class with the mixed 250-500 on sand tracks a good 250 rider could keep up with them.
Can't really do supercross on 500s unless it's a biiiig wide sandy track in Holland Wink
Sure, it's a great bragging prop.. unchanged engine that is very simple and clean. it's a Honda. it's a great bike.
But...
I got to try a KX500. I liked it more than the CR. Sure, the frame and footpegs are questionable, but it felt much better and could squeeze more bike out of it. ( I swear it feels like the footpegs moved a few degrees after you really ride it...)
I hear bros tall tales of how much insane power the KX has, how dangerous it is, yadda yadda...
Nah. I'd rather race the KX and even take it for trail rides any time over the CR. This coming from a former Honda boy.

On my wish list: a good 85 CR500 for show and a clean KX500 to ride. And a Maico. And a 91 KTM with a loaned works engine please. All for fun and vintage racing Smile
For now I am happily living life with newer 300s from Mozartland.

I really think we over hyped the CR500. The riders made the difference. Broc Glover on the Yamaha Maytag contraption held it against Bailed on his ultra trick CR500.
Freaking Johnny O' and Bayle pinned 125s against CR500s successfully.
And very likely much easier with any modern 4 stroke.

JMB recently answered, when asked about theoretically pitching the old works 500 vs the new stuff, He'd get the new modern stuff without hesitation. yes, that modern stuff with the extra valves.

Those CR500s were great BACK THEN but life went on and there are newer things. I love vintage racing with everybody on oldies. Heck, I think drum brakes and dual shocks is where we should compare our manhoods.
Let's have a wide fast race with no man made jumps and see those CZs and Maicos go !! What if the old XR600 from Scott Summers is still competitive?
PS: I would like to see/try a modern 350 or 400 TWO stroke

I loved how the CR500s look. I have nostalgia, sure. They sound great with a unique throaty rattle and ping.
Kudos to the guy racing an older bike against the evil, easier strokers, great feat.
Yes it can be done and I applaud it.
No hate. I am just a bit tired of the hype. The myth of the CR500.
I spent the equivalent of 2 new bikes into one.
Whatever floats your boat. Your mileage may vary.
If you are happy with yours I can dig it.
Just my 2 long cents here.
Cheers




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SEEMEFIRST
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SEEMEFIRST 12/22/2020 1:25am
12/22/2020 1:25am
Chance1216 wrote:
Ever try starting it on a muddy hill in the rain? Frustration reaches a whole new level.
Don't get me started.
It's Murhpey's law. If you stall an 84 CR500, it will be in the worst possible place to get it started again.
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philG
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philG 12/22/2020 6:39am
12/22/2020 6:39am Edited Date/Time 12/22/2020 6:50am
And the thing to remember is , they arent racing on the same tracks as they were back then.. When i raced 500's tracks would be lucky to see a grader once a year, not 3 times a day.

If the tracks were prepped back then like they are now, they would never have gone away.
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Chance1216
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Chance1216 12/22/2020 7:55am
12/22/2020 7:55am
Chance1216 wrote:
Ever try starting it on a muddy hill in the rain? Frustration reaches a whole new level.
SEEMEFIRST wrote:
Don't get me started.
It's Murhpey's law. If you stall an 84 CR500, it will be in the worst possible place to get it started again.
On the side of a muddy hill in the rain. So slick you can’t get enough traction to bump start it. But wait, it gets better. After trying to bump start it sliding down this hill you end up between two hills in a valley full of water. The only way out is to drag it back up the hill sideways. Exhausted after all the kicking and cussing. Knowing what I know now, I would’ve kept it. Parked in the garage!! Back then, the 88 CR 250 I got was so much more enjoyable.
I still ended up getting a 92 CR 500 and loved it.
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spimx
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spimx 12/22/2020 8:14am
12/22/2020 8:14am
07 honda 450 and 09 yz 450s are still competitive.

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backinthesaddleagain 12/22/2020 9:39am
12/22/2020 9:39am
Chance1216 wrote:
On the side of a muddy hill in the rain. So slick you can’t get enough traction to bump start it. But wait, it gets better...
On the side of a muddy hill in the rain. So slick you can’t get enough traction to bump start it. But wait, it gets better. After trying to bump start it sliding down this hill you end up between two hills in a valley full of water. The only way out is to drag it back up the hill sideways. Exhausted after all the kicking and cussing. Knowing what I know now, I would’ve kept it. Parked in the garage!! Back then, the 88 CR 250 I got was so much more enjoyable.
I still ended up getting a 92 CR 500 and loved it.
After a year where I raced an 84 CR500 and an 85 CR125, I decided in 86 to get the CR250. What a bike. However I still liked just the raw open bike power for blasting open space, climbing hills, and sending roost into the next county. Think back to those times I bought the 500 for $900 used,put in one fork seal, used it a season and sold it for $800. What a great time.
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queen of spodes 12/22/2020 10:00am
12/22/2020 10:00am
CPR wrote:
There used to be a video of the race on YouTube but it appears the copyright police got it. If I remember rightly Sharky’s bike was...
There used to be a video of the race on YouTube but it appears the copyright police got it.

If I remember rightly Sharky’s bike was a 500 motor in a current KX250 frame, built with parts from local dealership Whale Kawasak and his dad was his mechanic. Certainly nothing exotic, but he holeshot all the unobtainium factory bikes, with fellow Aussie Byrner in tow on a stock CR500 with bolt-ons.

Side note- Max Whale, son of Whale Kawasaki owner Brett Whale is now racing pro dirt track in the USA.


Why do people do this. Where can I buy a copy of that race? Oh it's not available, then why flag it for fucking copyright removal on youtube.
Alex.434
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Alex.434 12/22/2020 8:26pm
12/22/2020 8:26pm Edited Date/Time 12/22/2020 8:26pm
Aaron's OCD / organizational skills are very impressive. Can't wait to try his 500 rebuild out. Braaapt! Thing came out so well.
Analogue* 12/22/2020 9:40pm
12/22/2020 9:40pm
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Nice work guys restoring a legend . Never had a '94 but got an '01 in the shed. Zero hours. Good work

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